Three things from this week’s rather sentimental pod with our friend Nile Gardiner:
It wasn’t the crown or the jewels, but the stubborn apolitical rule of QEII that made her beloved.
We think it was The Crown that introduced us to the real Elizabeth, but it’s the contrast with her kids that lays bare her quality.
No one likes Meghan Markle — well, no one we know — but the late Queen always treated her like a member of the family. That’s legendary self control.
You might be scratching your head asking why Team WTH thought a pod necessary on the life and legacy of QEII. Marc is resolutely republican. Dany is resolutely royalist.* But the bottom line is that there are very, very few people that have earned the respect, the love, and the admiration that Elizabeth did over her long life. Sports are no longer the apolitical haven they used to be; Thanksgiving dinner stopped being sacrosanct long ago; what can we all agree on (well, what can good people agree on)? The Queen was a Great Lady, with caps.
It’s not easy being a monarch — so much ceremony, so little fun. But Queen Elizabeth took it all like the trooper she was, with duty and humor. Her jubilee video with Paddington Bear was epic. Her sketch with James Bond for the Olympics was hilarious.
King Charles III promises less humor, more sanctimony, less self-awareness. But this week isn’t about him, or about the increasingly unpopular Commonwealth. It’s about celebrating a life well-lived, with honor, faith, love of country and duty. There are few of us who would decline such a fine epitaph.
*Royalist only for the UK and Australia. We did the right thing in 1776.
HIGHLIGHTS
The best of the queen?
NG: What I think was especially remarkable about her seven decades as monarch was the fact that she was a woman, I think, of remarkable humility throughout that period, selflessness. And I think that what people really admire in the Queen was this sense of dedication. This idea that someone would be spending every moment of their life really living for their country without complaints, without Meghan Markle-style narcissism.
Of course, not everyone loved the Queen…
NG: I was struck by the outpouring of grief and mourning in India, [a] former part of the British Empire… I think it's her spirit and her tremendous sense of dedication, selflessness, it just cannot fail to inspire. And I think she left the monarchy in even stronger health than when she inherited it.
So what about her successor?
NG: Charles as prince had a very mixed record. I would say he was not particularly well-loved or popular for many decades. It's only in recent years I think that Charles has become more popular in the UK. But as we have seen, in the past few days I think he has stepped into the role of King Charles III in a very admirable fashion. If Charles actually continues on this path, if he follows the example set by his mother, also maintaining very strict political neutrality, and keeping out of making political statements on the environment, or immigration, and so on, I think Charles is going to do okay.
But there's no doubt about it, that I think many in Britain are looking to his son Prince William becoming king eventually. It maybe two to three decades from now. William is massively popular with the British public, and Kate of course is also massively popular. So I do think the long-term fate of the monarchy is looking very positive
We’re flying our flags at half mast here in the USA…
NG: The vast majority of Americans really admire and love the Queen, not least because of the character that she stood for and just the lovely personality and the dedication she had. But there is, I would say, a vocal woke far left element in America who don't like the British monarchy. And you're seeing that on the pages of the New York Times and Washington Post over the course of the last few days. And also if you watch CNN with some of the experts, one thinks of Christiane Amanpour, [she] went on air I think this morning demanding that King Charles start the process of reparations for former members of the British Empire.
If that was the case, why are the vast majority of countries that used to be part of the empire part of the Commonwealth today and actively mourning the death of Queen Elizabeth II?
But it’s true some members of the Commonwealth are eager to dump the monarchy…
NG: There's a lot of debate across the Commonwealth and also in those nations where the Queen is still head of state. That includes Australia, Canada, New Zealand. There's been ongoing debate for many decades. I would say though that the momentum for removing the Queen as head of state is no more significantly powerful today than it was even 20, 30 years ago.
But as you point out, the Caribbean countries, there is a growing campaign of course to separate those nations from the monarchy, and we'll have to see what happens. Prince William's trip to the Caribbean did not go as smoothly as one had hoped, and so there is a significant amount of trouble ahead as well in some parts of the commonwealth and especially in Caribbean nations where some of those countries, part of their population want to remove the Queen as head of state, so we're going to see the ongoing battle.
So she’s not universally loved…?
NG: The biggest attacks on the monarchy and Queen Elizabeth II over the last few days have come not so much from commonwealth countries, but from the American woke left. The monarchy is a very big target for them, and the vitriol and the hatred that I see on the pages of the New York Times and the Washington Post, for example, is absolutely astounding, actually.
And you also see the same venom I think directed at Brexit and a rising anti-British sentiment you see on the left wing press in America. It's striking how many, I would say, political commentators in the United Kingdom, many of whom are the children of immigrants to the UK from Africa or Asia for example, who've hit back against the American woke left saying they need to mind their own business, stop attacking the monarchy. And you have seen a real fight back by Brits on this.
Didn’t the Queen mismanage the entire Princess Diana saga?
NG: Diana's death actually could really have destroyed the monarchy in so many respects. It was such an incredibly powerful, and it was the most difficult moment of the Queen's life I think as well. And the Queen really had to respond I think to a massive outpouring of grief from the British public that you hadn't seen before in relation to royal matters.
[But] she listened to what the British people were saying, she was somebody who was willing actually to also move with the times in many respects, while maintaining all the traditions of the crown. But the Queen was also pragmatic. And I think the film, The Queen, actually, which I highly recommend to anybody who hasn't seen it, I think captured that turmoil, but also the tremendous leadership of the Queen at the time. And I think [she] weathered the storm.
Full transcript here.
SHOWNOTES
Queen Elizabeth II was one of the greatest leaders of the modern era (Fox, Nile Gardiner, September 12, 2022)
NG tweet response to a WaPo article “We must speak the ugly truths about Queen Elizabeth and Britain’s empire” (Washington Post, September 10, 2022)
Britain’s New Prime Minister Liz Truss Can Be a U.K. Powerhouse Just Like Margaret Thatcher Was (Heritage, Nile Gardiner, September 9, 2022)
Queen Elizabeth II symbolized stability throughout her record-long reign (Washington Post, September 9 2022)
Queen Elizabeth II Was a Pillar of Stability in Tumultuous Times (Foreign Policy, September 8, 2022)
The Queen’s Diplomacy (Foreign Affairs, September 10, 2022)
With Queen Gone, Former Colonies Find a Moment to Rethink Lasting Ties (NY Times, September 11, 2022)
Antigua and Barbuda may try to remove King Charles III as its head of state (NPR, September 11, 2022)